from the comment section. Also at end I have found the video so link also at the end with the English translation, sort of fast pace but good when you have already read the background to it
Austrian MP Ewald Stadler's powerful address to the Turkish Ambassador. Finally ...... an eviscerating response
KGS says:
02/12/2010 at 17:03
Paul, I will check on that.
Here ya go: The English translation
Now Ewald Stadler from BZÖ
Mr federal minister, I want to make a request – and knowing that
this debate will be followed closely at the Turkish embassy
I will give it in the exact wording:
The federal minister for European and International Affairs is requested to
declare the Turkish ambassador Kadri Ecvet Tezcan ‚persona non grata’ and
demand his immediate dismissal
Gentlemen,of the turkish embassy –
I am not gonna be as polite as my colleague van der Bellen falling on my knees speaking of your “excellency”.
No, “gentlemen” of the turkish embassy – there are no ladies there…
„Gentlemen“ of the Turkish embassy, members of parliament,
let me begin with a murdercase. 3rd June 2010- not that long ago, federal minister in the city of Iskenderun, Archbishop Luigi Padovese was stabbed 8 times into the heart, by a 26-year-old muslim Murat Altun, screaming
“allahu akhbar" “Allah is the greatest!”
The archbishop ran from his garden onto the streets calling for help – in vain. Here the perpetrator cut off his head, leaving it to hang from the body on a piece of skin.
Many priests have been murdered in Turkey since 2008, one in the year 2008…….These are your friends! You should be ashamed, thats why you don’t like it!
- What did you say? “What’s with the drama?”
I know that you do not care for this drama.
Thats the reason! – I have been waiting for this.
Your devotion to freedom of religion is nothing but pure hypocrisy!after the jump are further comments and richness of translation, and some other posts giving good background. Bruce Thornton's post gives interesting context of what was taking place during Stadler's speech.
When a catholic archbishop’s head is cut off, there is no reaction !
And now let me address the gentlemen of the Turkish embassy
I can’t even imagine the uproar if somebody touched a muslim imam or some other religiously esteemed muslim
- It doesn’t makes sense to call them “spiritual” leaders anyway-
never has a representative of your religion been assaulted,
but this happens every year in your country.
Take note of that ambassador, Foreign minister, we did not ask you to send us all the illiterates of Anatolia. Turkey sent them here
We haven’t asked you to send up your stone-age islamists from Anatolia either
People who bury their 16 year-old daughters alive, for having “extramarital relationships” as it happened 2 years ago.
We did not ask you to do that
Ms. Muhltonnen do you have any compassion for this 16-year old, whom was buried alive?
She wasn’t a catholic, so you ARE allowed to feel sorry for her
We did not tell you to send them here!
The Turks sent them up here
And then he (the ambassador) complains that they are not integrated,
while at the same time telling them not to integrate.
All the while Erbakan travels around European countries declaring
integration and assimilation “a crime against turkishness”!
Thats how it is
Ladies and gentlemen from the governing coalition,
With your romantics of tolerance and “devotion” to human rights
Do you know there is a law in Turkey – §301 in the Turkish lawbook
which means that if someone had said the things the ambassador said,
only directed towards Turkey.
he would be convicted as a criminal.
§301 criminalizes “belittlement of the Turkish nation, state, republic, institutions”
Which will lead to between 6 months and 2 years imprisonement
This is the Turkey, now telling us what to do
Mr. Ambassador enter the Orient Express and go back to Istanbul, your wonderland!
I am telling you…
I am telling you, this country is not exclusively made up of tolerance romantics
there are also people sick and tired of the oneway-street tolerance babble
Which you feed on, Mr. Ambassador
You are exploiting it, not?
And I have to tell you, a few people in politics will not accept this
And the voters outside, do not accept it at all, I can tell you that for sure
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A comment from a blog; adding a richness of translation
http://wdtprs.com/blog/2010/12/austrian-mp-tells-it-like-he-sees-it-kablam/#comments
-JMody says:
6 December 2010 at 8:45 pm
Folks that can’t understand German really missed out — he is lapsing into what we would call “brutally frank” or even “unprofessional” comments. His remarks about not using terms like “excellency” — what he said in German was that he wasn’t going to use such a word or knell, because that might make his trousers dusty.
At 3:18, where he’s talking about burying a 16-year-old for shaming her family, and he addresses one of his colleagues, he says “what’s your problem, Frau Muhltonnen” –> that’s probably not her real name, since “Muehltonne” means “waste basket” or “trash can”, and with his accent, I can’t tell which word he’s actually saying. But she should feel free to feel pity, because the victim wasn’t Catholic … ! My German wife’s jaw hit the floor about four times during the speech here, and the rest of the time she was cheering him on.
William F. Buckley once wrote about how a certain anti-Communist/Soviet measure must be as effective as dripping holy water into Hell with an eye-dropper — and it seems to describe this speech perfectly. All I can say is:
“Herr Stadler, bravissimo! Voll Einsetzen!!”
St. Marco d’Aviano (shameless plug for coffee would work well here, Fr. Z., I can’t believe you missed it!!) pray for us.
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Jitpring says:
7 December 2010 at 12:41 pm
I love this speech. I love it so very much! Maybe there’s still some hope in Eurabia. On a related note, I recommend that everyone search for and read these two articles from Theodore Dalrymple, who is, in my view, today’s greatest essayist and cultural critic:
When Islam Breaks Down
&
The Barbarians at the Gates of Paris
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http://www.jihadwatch.org/2010/12/austrian-mp-ewald-stadler-to-turkish-ambassador-people-are-sick-and-tired-of-the-one-way-street-tole.html
demsci replied to comment from Lou Bator
December 4, 2010 1:26 AM
Reply
I love your post.
To me to we should be FOR some cause and not AGAINST Islam primarily. Hence for now I like us to be FOR worldwide freedom and all essential Democratic laws and values and them infidels in respect to that.
Let the Muslims be insufficiently: freedom-loving, democratic, pro human rights, pro golden rule. Which we are. So they are non-democracy-loyalists or something like that to me. We are FOR something they LACK in my view.
And we should let them worry about how to stop us, instead of us worrying how to stop them.
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Wess
December 4, 2010 1:34 AM
Reply
First, these people simply worship a false god. Allah (and I wouldn't have capitalized his name had it not been the first word in the sentence) is not God...the names are not interchangeable Call me narrow-minded if you want. Jesus, himself said the way is through the narrow door. These folks are simply barking up the wrong tree. Oh, and by the way...ask any muslim for the word equivalent to GRACE in islam...THERE ISN'T ONE. As a Christian, I bring nothing to my salvation except the sin which makes it necessary. I thank God for His Grace! JESUS PAID IT ALL!
Second, islam is a political, religious, and economic way of life. This isn't just a religion. This would certainly never be tolerated by the Christians, the Jews, the Budhists, the Hindus, nor do any of these groups try the things muslims do. Just look at the persecution today of Christians just for breathing, much less to try and get some parallel law to constitutional law imposed. Religion of peace...CRAP. Open any page of their "bible"...doesn't take long to see what they are all about. Plus, if Christians made all the the hoopla about "soiling" the Bible, you would see folks peeing on Bibles everyday just for the sh#ts and giggles of it. But everyone today is completely mortified of ripping up a Koran, or drawing a cartoon or not installing a prayer room somewhere. If someone were to burn some Bibles today, it wouldn't get 10 seconds of network news time.
Their "founder" floundered for converts when he started up this insane thinking, but after he introduced violence into the equation, he began to quickly take on supporters. Sober up...mosques are just outposts for the jihad...plain and simple.
Also, never forget: Smiling and telling you "we are a peaceful people" or any other mess such as that is just another plank of their platform...lieing (or doing anything else, for that matter) to advance the cause of islam. What else would you expect a heathen to do?
To the True and Living God, we have all come short of the glory of God...and there are Christians who do horrible and dispicable things. But the arrogance of these idol-worshipping people with their holier than thou attitude is utterly incomprehensible to me when they put their faith in a bunch of virgins. But believe me, I pray that these folks' hearts are changed, and God CAN do that...my disgust is not in their unbelief...it's their crap about convert or die, their deceit, their hatred for the Jews (which will NEVER go away and is shared by our chief executive, by the way), their treatment of women...should I keep going?
WAKE UP, AMERICA...as well as the world. Muslim ideology is world DOMINATION. And our president is sympathetic to this cult, and is going out of his way to use his power and influence to make islam palatable to all of us...and quite frankly, I'm not buying any of it.
May the God of all creation crush the islamic movement in this country, and make them a footstool to Him.
Call me what you will. But there will be a day where every knee WILL bow and every tongue WILL confess that Jesus is Lord and King.
How's that for ya?
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demsci replied to comment from notoshariah
December 4, 2010 1:47 AM
Reply
I already was in favor of focusing on contents of what people were saying rather than the tone in which they were saying it.
And I for one like people first and foremost to focus on the message and not on the messenger.
As we democracy-loyal people, also can and will use these same standards regarding messages of Muslims and Islam-defenders in a fair way, as Robert Spencer always does ...
I think we can't afford to throw away valuable messages because of tone and the credentials of the messengers.
demsci replied to comment from notoshariah
December 4, 2010 2:20 AM
Reply
It is not so simple at all!
Stadler here operated in a fully democratic setting, he is subject to all fair scrutiny, as you yourself show. We who value and want to promote democratic values, can and should encourage messages like this, when the democratic process is in full swing.
Please compare real countries, real working democracies, with all their faults, ONLY with other real countries and how other countries really work,
Of course less idealistic than some kind of utopia you might envision.
To me, mankind is slowly, blundering at times, creeping upwards, fighting each step of the way. This was a great step in the right direction. We can even be glad it came from a totalitarian or former totalitarian.
People who really have all the essential Democratic values at heart can recognize differences in messages from the same people. But at the same time can't afford to pick and choose only what is coming from people totally without blame. While the enemy is bound by no such rules at all.
You are arguing from a luxury position we don't have. I think we should utilize all that Democratic rules and consciences legitimately permits us to use.
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Fanusi Khiyal
December 4, 2010 6:51 AM
Reply
To me, mankind is slowly, blundering at times, creeping upwards, fighting each step of the way. This was a great step in the right direction. We can even be glad it came from a totalitarian or former totalitarian.
demsci, I agree with the general sentiment, but not the particular you are deriving it. How about this? We can say we absolutely agree with what he is saying, even if he has very questionable associations, and we hope that he will show that he has completely broken with those in defense of civilization?
Wess, blow it out your ear. If it weren't for Christianity, we wouldn't be fighting this mutant heresy now. And if Christianity could at least fight properly, we would have dealt with this a long, long time back.
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Battle_of_Tours replied to comment from demsci
December 4, 2010 9:12 AM
Reply
Moreover, it seems to me that it is reasonable to see Muslims by default more loyal to the Ummah than to the Democratic countries they live in. Which means the burden of proof for the opposite is on them, not us anymore.
Reciprocity and equality. These are the two elements totally missing in the Islamic theo-political ideology universe, which is not surprising because these two did not exist in the 7th century; nor were they nurtured into any kind of evolved thinking over the next 1400 years of self-professed, self-serving, self-congratulatory Jihad, and self-ego-id of a bandit Warlord's lust for conquest and booty, especially women slaves, which marks the dismal history of Islam from its inception to the present. They never evolved concepts of "reciprocity and equality" because it was not "written" into their Koranic play book. Equality and reciprocity were never imagined by their Warlord founder's delusions of grandeur, to rule with his Allah as supreme master over all his 'submissive' slaves.
Speakers who are speaking out on the reality of Islam, such as Wilders, Stadler, Spencer, Geller, and others (don't know about Haider), are all stating the obvious, that we are no longer deceived by those Muslims who swear false loyalty to our Western democratic values of freedom. The Ummah can only be loyal to its primitive 7th century theo-political ideology, and never to "reciprocity and equality", since in their lexicon "Allah did not will it." ;-)
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BRUCE THORNTON ON Ewald Stadler: Another European Who Gets IslamThere are still some who stand up against the suicidal appeasement of Islamby Bruce Thornton in 'Politics'
http://rightnetwork.com/posts/1001642458
Austrian MP Ewald Stadler adresses Turkish Ambassador
Those of us who are hard on Europeans for their cringing appeasement of Muslim aggression need to acknowledge and support the brave few who speak out against it. The late Oriana Fallaci challenged her fellow Europeans to recognize the threat that unassimilated Muslim immigrants and an illiberal Islamic doctrine posed to Western civilization. Geert Wilders, the Dutch politician under indictment simply for publicizing the truth about Islam’s theology of violence, is another defender of the West’s unique goods of political freedom and individual rights. We can add to this list Austrian member of parliament Ewald Stadler, whose recent tongue-lashing of the Turkish ambassador exposed the hypocrisy and double standards that too many Westerners accept in the face of Muslim intolerance and violence.
Stadler was responding to an interview with the ambassador in which he complained about Austria’s failure to do more to integrate its Muslim immigrants, and put the blame on Austrians for being intolerant, xenophobic, and illiberal –– traits, of course, that permeate Islamic cultures. In response to this sermon on tolerance, Stadler brought up the murder in Turkey of Archbishop Luigi Padovese, who was stabbed eight times and then beheaded in the street by a young Muslim shouting “allahu akhbar.” When the ambassador sneered “What’s with the drama,” Stadler excoriated him, calling his “devotion to religious freedom pure hypocrisy,” and making the point obvious to anybody paying attention for the last decade: “I can’t imagine the uproar if someone touched a Muslim imam or some other religiously esteemed Muslim.”
On the point of integration and its failure, Stadler pointed out the hypocrisy of the ambassador whining about Austria’s failure to integrate Turks while ex-Prime Minister Necmettin Erbakan travels around Europe calling assimilation a “crime against Turkishness”–– the sort of statement, as Stadler points out, that if said in Turkey against Turkish policies would lead to criminal prosecution.
The European 'romantics of tolerance'
Stadler, however, links this double standard to Europe’s “romantics of tolerance,” who indulge such “one-way-street tolerance babble.” This double standard is so pervasive in the West that it is now an unthinking reflex, devoid of historical knowledge or even logic.
Westerners are supposed to show respect and tolerance for Muslims and Islam, all the while that Muslims do not show the same respect to Christians and Jews. The brutal murder of priests and religious in Muslim lands, the desecration of churches and shrines, the persecution of Christians so extensive that they are disappearing from regions which were their homelands for centuries –– none of this is deemed newsworthy in Western mainstream media. Instead the very same media publicize and decry the most trivial of offenses against Islam or Mohammed, and rationalize and excuse the violence that typically follows such incidents. Meanwhile, as churches and Christians are becoming extinct in the Middle East, mosques are springing up all over Europe, many of them fonts of jihadist preaching and recruiting.
The same appeasing double standard empowers our acceptance of Orwellian history as an excuse for Muslim violence. Thus the West is supposed to feel guilty and obsess over its alleged imperialistic and colonial crimes against Islam, all the while that the longer chronicle of Islamic violence, conquest, raids, kidnapping, and occupation directed at Europe is forgotten.
Nowhere is this selective history more obvious and dangerous for our interests than in the role Jerusalem has taken on as the emblem of Western oppression of Islam through its neo-colonial proxy Israel. The holy city of Judaism, attested as such in history and archeology for three millennia, was seized by conquest in 638 A.D. by Muslims and occupied by them until 1967, when the Israelis liberated Jerusalem in a defensive war. Yet as good Westerners respectful of religious freedom, the Israelis left untouched the Islamic mosques constructed on the site of the Temple, and they allow Muslims to control and manage the most holy site in Judaism, free to worship in the mosque while they allow their children to throw stones on the Jews who come to worship at the few scraps of the temple wall, all that is left to them of their holiest site.
The long history of Muslim destruction
of Jewish temples and Christian churches is ignored
But this forbearance and tolerance cut no ice with a religion that believes, as the Koran has it, that Muslims are “the best of nations raised for (the benefit) of men,” and that deems the Jews’ possession of the their own spiritual homeland an abomination justifying terrorist violence. Even more despicable, the countries of the West go along with this canard. They decry the “illegal occupation” of Jerusalem and Judea and Galilee, refuse to put their embassies in the capital of Israel, and continually demand more and more Israeli concessions to a people who have made it clear that their conquest of Jerusalem is legitimate, and so it is Israelis, not they, are the interlopers in the Jews’ historical homeland, and violence against innocents is justified to undo a history deemed to violate Allah’s will.
Worse yet, the long history of Muslim destruction of Jewish temples and Christian churches is ignored or considered irrelevant. Consider just one example of thousands, the Muslim desecration of Christian churches during the sack of Constantinople, including Hagia Sophia, along with St. Peter’s Christendom’s most important church. On May 29, 1453, John Julius Norwich writes, “by noon the streets were running red with blood. Houses were ransacked, women and children raped or impaled, churches razed, icons wrenched from their golden frames, books ripped from their silver bindings. . . . In the church of St Saviour in Chora the mosaics and frescoes were miraculously spared, but the Empire’s holiest icon, the Virgin Hodegetria, said to have been painted by St. Luke himself, was hacked into four pieces and destroyed.
The most hideous scenes of all, however, were enacted in the church of the Holy Wisdom [Hagia Sophia]. Matins were already in progress when the berserk conquerors were heard approaching. Immediately the great bronze doors were closed; but the Turks soon smashed their way in. The poorer and more unattractive of the congregation were massacred on the spot; the remainder were lashed together and led off to the Turkish camps, for their captors to do with as they liked. As for the officiating priests, they continued with the Mass as long as they could before being killed at the high altar.”
There is a religion that believes
there is plenty to kill and die for....
For Western apologists and appeasers, however, this history is irrelevant, at the same time they accept their own putative crimes against Islam as justifications for Muslim violence. The 150 years of European presence in the Middle East––a region, remember, Hellenic, Roman, Hebrew, and Christian for millennia before the Islamic conquests––is the original historical sin of the West that today excuses jihadist terrorism and violence. At the same time, the centuries of Muslim occupation of Spain, Sicily, the Balkans, and Greece––and the continuing occupation of Asia Minor, the heartland of the Hellenic and Christian Byzantine Empire now known as Turkey–– are apparently legitimate. I suppose there is some statute of limitations on conquest and occupation, so that the conquests of Islam are legitimized by time, while those of the West can never be.
We know why many in the West indulge in “one-way-street tolerance babble.” A spurious tolerance is merely the reflex of the spiritually exhausted who stand for anything because they stand for nothing. Christianity is either dead for many in the West, or has degenerated into a feel-good therapeutic cult whose prime directive is cultivating self-esteem and being nice to others.
Fundamentalist secularization has created John Lennon’s suicidal utopia: nothing to kill or die for, and no religion too. Unfortunately, there is a religion that believes there is plenty to kill and die for, and its adherents view our “tolerance” and “love of diversity” as weakness and fear, and our hatred for our own culture and indulgence of those who despise it as testimony not to our sophisticated cosmopolitanism, but to our inferiority and submission. At least there are some, even in Europe, willing to speak the truth about this craven appeasement.
Bruce Thornton
Bruce Thornton is a professor of classics and humanities at Fresno State University. He is also a National Fellow at the Hoover Institution. He is the author of eight books, [Available HERE ]and his numerous essays and reviews have appeared in both scholarly journals and magazines such as The New Criterion, Commentary, National Review, The Weekly Standard, and The Claremont Review of Books. He has lectured at many colleges and universities and at venues such as the Smithsonian Institute, the Intercollegiate Studies Institute, the Army War College, and the Air Force Academy. His latest book, forthcoming in 2011, is The Wages of Appeasement. Ancient Athens, Munich, and Obama’s America.
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another comment and picks up on the response and reply "what is the drama"
Submitted by Lindsay Perigo on Fri, 2010-12-03 05:54.
... took me to this:
A Muslim imam who lectures on non-violence and advises the German government on interfaith issues has been arrested in Germany for beating up his wife.
In any event, I'm amazed at this MP. As a rule, there's no such thing as "fearless" in public discourse. The most sickening part is when he's describing the beheading of a Catholic Archbishop, and the burying alive of a 16-year-old girl, and someone says, "What's the drama?" That's all but a handful of humanity summed up right there. "What's the drama? It's just someone getting his head chopped off! What's the drama? It's just some girl being buried alive. What's the drama? It's just a three-year-old being molested by a bulldyke. What's the drama? It's just 6 million Jews being gassed."
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moudoka December 4, 2010 at 5:16 am
Rated Awesome! What do you think? 20 0
He’s totally right. They allow non-muslim priests and believers to be brutally murdered at the drop of a hat, while mere cartoons of their “prophets” and other such gibberish incite death and riots.
Tolerance my ass.
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Austrian MP goes off on Turkish Ambassador over double-standard, Christian persecution
http://te-deum.blogspot.com/2010/12/austrian-mp-goes-off-on-turkish.html
Unless you know German, you have to watch the English subtitles. I know little about MP Ewald Stadler of Austria, other than he is Catholic. I can only judge what I see in this video on it's face. There are some things here, said in a moment of passion that I think were imprudent, and I don't believe in broadbrushing every person of one ethnicity or religion. What I do agree with him on is what he says about the double standard and "tolerance romanticism", as well as what he says about human rights violations in Turkey.
This video is making it's way around the globe and gaining steam in popularity. Muslims complain about discrimination when living abroad in non-Muslim countries while at the same time Christians are losing liberty, life and limb in Muslim-ruled places, including Turkey. He then raises the human rights issues - especially against women in Turkey, such as a case where a 16 year old girl was buried alive by her father and grandfather for talking with boys.
The Turkish Ambassador had been vocally complaining in the media, getting the dander up of not a few politicians who called for his dismissal. Stadler points out that what Ambassador Ecvat Tezcan said would have earned him from 6 months to 2 years in a Turkish prison had he said such things about his own country. So, MP Ewald Stadler moved to have him declared a "persona non grata" and removed from his position. The assembly applauds repeatedly.
He brings up the murder of Archbishop Padovese in Turkey, and the fact that many priests have been murdered in Turkey since 2008.
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I am not sure if it is all as I understand the speech was 5 minutes 25 seconds long. He sure does not pull his punches.
I am also looking for the English tranlation. If you know where please leave me a message/comment and url or link or name of website or blog.
Now the video link
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v2-e6_Bdzyc
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